Pretribulation or posttribulation rapture?

[resin8love]

Hi, I would like to know some thoughts on pre-tribulation or post-tribulation rapture of the Christians, or if you don't believe Jesus Christ is to return for His church at all and why. This is not as important , but what is important do you have a personal relationship Jesus Christ and are born again, repenting of sins? Bible prophecy is being fulfilled in rapid sucsestion during the times in which we live. The mark of the beast is almost on everything "bar coded computer tags". Weapons so powerful they can shake the heavens, information changing hands in a blink of an eye, etc. What do you think? Are we going to pulled before great destruction or have to go through till the last trumpet sounds and we all get called into the clouds with Jesus Christ? Any bible verses are welcome, I welcome non Christians to answer to. There has been a lot of talk about devastation on a grand scale and lets face it there is enouph bombs to do it let alone another astroid or meteor could slam us. God bless you and peace.

[Wolfjk]

Hi Resin8love,
The world will end in flames but not yet! It has another 4.5 billion years to go!
If you look around you, its religions that cause most of the trouble on Earth.
Cheers Wolfjk

[North Star]

I'm not a Premillennist or Postmillennialist, but an Amillennialist .

This is a separate issue . . . some Ammillenniests believe the anti-christ is in the world today. But, I don't. In fact, I don't think this generation or the next will be alive during his reign.

)))))

We may be entering the beginning of the Tribulation. I believe that the Tribulation will come in two parts and will be spread over a long period of time. Some things we will see in the first phase of the Tribulation will be greeted by a growing worldwide famine, the spread of Islam, a major nuclear detonation, a seemingly crushing blow to the Catholic Church (but, the Church will weather it and come back better than before), an economic collapse that will make the Great Depression look mild by comparison, and a frightening spectacle appearing in the sky. At the early stages of the Trib God will give a unique, but terrifying grace to each person on earth, which will either strengthen them for the trials ahead or further alienate them from God -- each person will make have to make a choice.

There will be a period of peace between the first part of the tribulation and the second. Rev 8:1 "And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven, as it were for half an hour." This silence in heaven, symbolizes the passage of time between the first and second parts of the Tribulation.

OK. I wrote more than I intended. Everything I said is mere speculation and I wouldn't sign my blood to it or stake my life on any of it .

As far as the rapture goes, I find the topic interesting, but mostly I don't worry about the specifics or lose any sleep over it. Maybe, because I don't think that I, or my children, or my children's children will live in long enough to see it happen.

Whether the end of the world comes for each of us one by one, or all at once, all I know for certain is that everybody dies and we all must prepare for this eventuality.

"But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow about his promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. . . . Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of persons ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be kindled and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire! But according to his promise we wait for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace" (2 Pet. 3:8–14).

[Varzandeh]

Hi,
As I as a muslim believe , at the last page of the world , Jesus Christ will come Back accompanied by an Imam from Islam and for a short period of time they will show a true govern.
But till that time the world will continue to exist as a school .People will come and live and will have trials to see who has the best manner.If God wanted all the people would be a unique nation and all in a right true belief.But as God says in a verse He has created them to have trials .
It makes no difference that who is muslim or christian or any other religion, after acceptance God and the last resurrection.Many muslims may behave worse than a zeihonist.But Zeihonist have occupied the world by their money and occupied usa and europe .
This matter is presaid in a few verse in Quran as a wide corruption they will do on the earth.
As islamic imams have said anti christ is the same television that in most cases is a liar and everybody knows that it is a non believer and corrupts everybody but still they follow the lie news and movies.


Here are a few verses about the montioned;

In the name of God the beneficent the merciful

11-118. And if your Lord had pleased He would certainly have made people a single nation and they shall continue to differ.

119- Except those on whom your Lord has mercy; and for this did He create them; and the word of your Lord if fulfilled; Certainly I will fill hell with the Jinn and the men, all together.

120- And all we relate to you of the accounts of the apostles is to strengthen your heart there with; and in this has come to you the truth and an admonition, and a reminder to the believers.

121. And say to those who do not believe: Act according to your state; surely we too are acting,


122 And wait; surely we are waiting also.

123- And God's is the unseen in the heavens and the earth, and to Him is returned the whole of the affairs; therefore serve Him and rely on Him, and your Lord is not heedless of what you do.


Family of Imran 189-195
In the name of God
189-And God's is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth , and God has power over all things.

190-Most surely in the creation of the heavens and the earth and the alternation of the night and the day there are signs for men who understand.

191- Those who remember God standing and sitting and lying on their sides and reflect on the creation of the heavens and the earth: Our Lord! Thou hast not created this in vain! Glory be to Thee; save us then from the chastisement of the fire.

192- Our Lord! Surely whomsoever Thou makest enter the fire, him Thou hast indeed brought to disgrace, and there shall be no helpers for the unjust:

193-Our Lord! Surely we have heard a preacher calling to the faith, saying: Believe in your Lord, so we did believe; Our Lord! Forgive us therefore our faults, and cover our evil deeds and make us die with the righteous.

194-Our lord! And grant us what thou hast promised us Thy apostles and disgrace us not on the day of resurrection; surely Thou dost not fail to perform the promise.

195-So their lord accepted their prayer; that I will not waste the work of a worker among you, whether male or female, the one of you being from the other;they, therefore, who fled and were turned out of their homes and persecuted in My way and who fought and were slain, I will most certainly cover their evil deeds, and I will most certainly make them enter gardens beneath which rivers flow; a reward from God , and with God is yet better reward.

196- Let it not deceive you that those who disbelieve go and fro in the cities fearlessly.

197- A brief enjoyment! Then their abode is hell, and evil is the resting-place.

[North Star]

Varzandeh wrote,

If God wanted all the people would be a unique nation and all in a right true belief.But as God says in a verse He has created them to have trials .
It makes no difference that who is muslim or christian or any other religion, after acceptance God and the last resurrection.Many muslims may behave worse than a zeihonist

Wow, I was surprised to see you write this. If I understand what you are saying, as a Muslim, you personally believe that Christians and Jews can make it to heaven without converting to Islam?

Few of the Muslims that I have talked to, including the moderate one, adhere to this position. So, again, I am sort of shocked to see you say this. Let me ask again, are you saying that you believe that a person doesn't have to follow the teachings that God allegedly revealed through Mohammed in order to go to heaven?

_______


As far as End Times go . . . I think that the Muslim's Mahdi will play a major role.

From what I have read, the Mahdi is prophecized as being the long-awaited Messiah of Islam. He will attempt to establish a new Islamic world order throughout the entire earth. He will fight against the enemies of the Muslims . . . and the enemies of Islam are all infidels, which means all non-Mulsims (including Israel and the West).

Working this in with my personal view of end times, this Mahdi will reappear during the last phase of the Tribulation to wage war against the forces of "evil" (which, to Muslims, would be the West and Israel). He will lead a world revolution and try to set up a new world order, hoping to make Islam victorious over all religions.

As a Christian, I actually believe that your Mahdi will come, but with all due respect, I have to say that I don't look on him as a savior and I don't think that I will be alive during his reign. As you don't believe that Jesus is God, I don't believe that the Mahdi will be who he claims to be.

I am only speculating, of course.

_____

As far as the television being a corruptor, I agree with you. TV can corrupt both believer and non-believer alike, but I don't think that TV is the anti-christ. I think that the anti-christ will be a man.

[Varzandeh]

Hi,
The cow 2:62

In the name of God
Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the christens, and the Sabians, whoever believes in God and the last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.

The Iron 57:27
In the name of God

Then we made our apostles to follow in their footsteps, and we sent Jesus son of Marium afterwards, and we gave him the bible; and we put in the hearts of those who followed him kindness and mercy; and (as for) monkery, they innovated it- We didn’t prescribe it to them- only to seek God’s pleasure, but they didn’t observe it with its due observance; so we gave to those of them who belived their reward, and most of them are transgressors.

And As we Sheeat of Alee and prophets succeeders believe Mahdi will come as a saviror with Jesus Christ and Christians will follow Him as a prophet but the prophets have no difference with each other.
Everyone when is adult is inspirated Bad and Good , so till that time the world is as it due to be everybody comes and lives and will have one or two big trials each year.
Good luck.

[Robert.P.Bennett]

Dear Writer, I am getting very strong vibrations that a star gate is about to open which will make feasible the passage of quite a number of earthlings electromagnetic signatures (spirits) to pass through to gain knowledge from ascended masters from higher demensions and other universes. You may call this a rapture if you wish. Those chosen to pass through this portal are service to others oriented and will gain accelerated knowledge in love, compassion, service to community ,etc instructions. Most generally I put out an automatic writing locally to announce these upcoming celestial events. However I am doing some listening to other peoples thoughts and definitions on this matter first. Its always nice to know others are sensing the same vibrations on the near event horizon. In other words I agree with you in principle the event you describe is about to happen, with the exception there are more ascended masters besides Jesus Christ in all due respect. In my opinion all religions and cultures have a lot of information on future celestial events, however they are somewhat disguised in allegory. Thanks for listening: Bob Bennertt